Monday, February 06, 2006

I'M MOVING ON, BABY....TA TA

A scene in a medical consultation room.

Patient (with eyes half-closed): I'm having severe giddiness. Bad spinning sensation. Nauseus. Vomited twice already.

Doctor: How long? Is this your first time?

Patient: Few days. Yes. (looking pale and started to slump in the chair)

Doctor: Had enough sleep?

Patient: No. Can't sleep well at all.

Doctor: Since when? This sleeping problem?

Patient: Years. Only sleep for 2 hours each night.

Doctor: Hmm..insomnia....what's bugging you? Feeling depressed?

Patient: Nodded and closed eyes.

Husband: I think she is worried about something and that's the real culprit.

Doctor: I see. (not wanting to probe any further as patients 'dah berlonggok' outside and can't waste time)

After physical examination, Dr gave I/M Stemetil and prescribed some oral anti-vertigo. Patient limply stepped out. But husband stayed on.

Husband: I am her problem. I am the reason she can't sleep.

Doctor: Oh..ok.

Husband: You see. I have an affair with another woman and I want to marry her. But she would only marry me after I have divorced my wife.

Doctor: hmmm...

Husband: So now I am preparing my wife to be independent. I will divorce her but I will leave her the house, the car and a fixed monthly income. I still love her, though. She doesn't have to work. And I'll start a new life with the woman.

Doctor: (tolonglah, patient dah bising/ gelisah di luar. Dia ni tak nak keluar ke? He's taking other patient's time) But this marital situation of yours, it's nothing that I can fix. But I can help to refer your wife to a psychiatrist if her mental status gets worse (who wouldnt? can a wife stay calm when the hubby is telling her that he is about to divorce her for another women despite promising her all the worldly comforts?)

Husband: I hope you understand. I need to think of myself too. She is at that age where there's a great tendency to neglect the man's needs.

Doctor: Yeah. (whatever) (needs/ nafs). Just tell me when she needs the referal.

Husband leaves the room and Doctor presses for the next number. *sigh*

~Some of you might have missed a point here from this entry (I know some of us due to time constraint wil brush through reading an entry, only extricating the gist). You see I am not discussing poligamy here. Polygamy is not an issue. It's halal. The issue here is that he is divorcing his wife for another .Can a man divorce a wife without any valid reason but simply because he wants to take another who demands he divorced the first??? ~

50 comments:

wanderer said...

hoh...
speechless jap.
how could he say that, with a straight face (i assume)?

Em said...

Ola Dr

Senangnya dia cakap gitu macam tukar baju or kereta..

Sigh...

Has said...

we can't say too much cos we don't know the real story. in many cases as such the wife usually will get the sympathy, but then if you know the actual predisposing factors, we probably give our blessing to the husband.

Has said...

DITH, I wrote something at Anim's site, but only realised that she is one of your links. Sorry. Now, I wonder why Keng is not listed? ;=? (busy thinking) he he.

lentiform said...

well, that's man for you.

the other day, one of the staffs was trying to sell us some beauty products, you know, those direct selling things, and she was telling us that the supervisor, or what-ever-you call it, who's in charge of this direct selling things, said to her, that one of the reason for divorce is when the wife started to neglect her appearance,( she was trying very hard to promote the stuffs)... well I thought, women didn't go around asking for divorce when their men started to turn bald, or boroi or etc.etc .....

abdullahjones said...

sekejap ada sekejap tak ada tulisan ni. pening ke doktor?

dr in the house said...

wanderer- well, he had difficulty in saying it out though

em- frankly he looked and sound like a nice person, maybe he was sufferring inside but didnt tell me because not wanting to make the wife look bad??

has- I've linked Ku the Keng so now you dont have to think hard anymore! Hehe

lentiform- but if we look at the aging Javanese ladies who perpetually 'live' on jamu, they definitely are living testimony of some kind arent they?

AJ- mana pulak AJ. Entry ni dok molek saja . Ke awak yang pening? :)) Bila nak balik Pancing?

Trust said...

My comment was deleted. Was it intentionally, doctor?

dr in the house said...

Trust- no I didnt delete any commen. Pls e comment. Sorry!

Ikelah said...

i guess there is something wrong with this guy. some of the connections must be worn off with age. he is not thinking properly. he thinks his wife cant perform her duty but what about him? he said he still love the present wife. so there will be a new perpatah melayu "sayang anak pukul-pukulkan, sayang isteri cerai-ceraikan". get Has to give him ECT. it might erase the 'abnormal beliefs' in him. Another thing, the future wife is just no good woman, by having the nerve to ask the stupid man to divorce the present wife.

Rasanya bila dia dah tua sikit dan kondem, dia pulak kena fasah oleh perempuan tak guna tu.

Has said...

Ya Allah, marahnya si Ikelah tuh. Believe me, I discovered in many cases the underlying problems were with the wives. I am a woman, but many a time, I think the man is entitled to his own hapiness or peace of mind. So my electrodes are ready, but probably not for the husband, keh, keh, keh.

Has said...
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Has said...
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Has said...
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Has said...

DITH, keh, keh, keh, bikin kacau saja, sorry ye. Asyura ingat nak kacau hari khamis malam, pagi jumaat boleh beri jiran.

i.e. kalau puasa hari rabu dan khamis, malam, lepas buka puasa kacau sura.

Queen Of The House said...

Kesiannya ..... maybe both of them needs counselling. Hantar aje to has, I'm sure she can knock some sense into them (whoever is at fault). Personally, I don't buy the bit about loving the wife yet hurting her that way. Not to say that the wife is faultless, though. But who knows. Sigh....

Paul Moss said...

No comment. I got my licence already.

easylady said...

What has said is true but I strongly agree with what Ikelah mentioned.Marriage is not only about sex.There are much more than that.The husband has been fooled by the young woman's appearance and the gatal-gatal birah act.(macam nama burung gatal birah pulak)The reason wife cannot perform are all lame excuses to get away from feeling guilty. Is there any other good reason to remarry?.

The young woman is attracted to the man only for his wealth.If it is for some other reason she will not insist the man to divorce the wife.

The promises that the man will support the wife,I am not sure will last cause it will be challenge by Allah.

I hope the wife will be strong enough to endure and overcome this hardship and Allah give some sense to the husband to think rationale. His mind right now has been clouded by the young woman's fantasy.

Paul Moss said...

I put a lot of thought on marriage during my younger days and that`s probably one of the reason I married at a late age. First I thought I ought to find someone who understands me, same frequescy as me, I should be deeply in love with her, be very sure and bla bla bla and then I will get married. All those never happen. People quit understanding me, I quit understanding people, different frequencies in the end give more excitement. Love? In the end I married someone I only met for 5 minutes during an engagement of a cousin.
So my marriage was not built on love or same frequency same head or understanding after all. On my part, it was built on my readiness to share everything. Love came later for a seasoned heart. So, if the sharing ends, the marriage might still be there but I can see myself being a figure explaining the struggling sacrificing my happiness, working day and night to keep the family together. My wife also will probably have the worst case scenario as someone who have used her hair as a mop, spent her youthful beauty to serve me and look how I showed my appreciation.
The gediks, Saruhan, shopping frenzy with friends, perempuan mata duitan etc are usually exit doors. They are not the reason but they became a reason eventually with the prayers from the wife or husband who are actually relieved to have a gedik to relate the whole cause of the problem and thefore no blame on themselves.
Sometimes there is really no one to blame. No fault no nothing. It`s halal. So go on. Some people not happy with that? It`s all within us. We can have everything and still be unhappy. I have the D50 and I`ll be happier if I can get the D200 because it`s an option and it`s there. Some can be happy easy, some can`t.

Queen Of The House said...

o doctor o doctor, give the wife some pills for a heartbreak ... ada ke?

Tj said...

I heard this so many times before..

"So now I am preparing my wife to be independent. I will divorce her but I will leave her the house, the car and a fixed monthly income.."

I dunno, IMHO, at my working level, I think it is a Big lie.

pycnogenol said...

I will just sigh along with you Dr Roza...a long, helpless sigh....

BTW Paul Moss, you make lots of sense there. Having seen it all happening in my family, I am somewhat reluctant to comment here. Bottomline is: One really have to get ALL the facts clear. More often than not, things are not what they seem to be.....
Believe me, it's all too easy for us all to be judgemental.

Count Byron said...

Wow.. complicated twist. He brought her to the clinic, knowing fully well that he was the cause; and she trudged along, fully aware that the one holding her hand is the root cause of her insomnia..
I think they both need to be put to sleep!

ayumi_of_mirkwood said...

Assalamualaikum..
Well well.. though I am not with the experience or shall I even say, a place to say this.. I guess this is what goes wrong when people take Islam for one thing or two. A good example is the polygamy thinggy. Sure, it's halal but they only use Islam when they want to get another wife. They forgot what the Qur'an says about getting ONLY one if they fear that they can't be just, that their wive(s) are garments to them, as much as they are garments to their wives, that sex is a form of sadaqa (not only one person's satisfaction is considered, but both), that they should provide the needs of all of their wives in a manner that is just and equal. Sadly, they let go of this principles once they've got what they need from the religion. Same goes to divorce.. There are so many ways that Islam tries to prevent divorce from happening. Divorce is the final step if all the other attempts are to no avail.. yet people forget it. They do all these things in a really bad taste, I would say... like this guy in your story. Sigh.

Ku Keng said...

Doc., check your harddisk. This blog has disappeared for almost two days. And also my earlier comment that appeared for a while, got eaten up when the blog disappeared. If it is deleted there would be a mark, but not so. Could it be kama-sutra? Hopefully not. Anyway give it a thorough anti-virus run.

p.s. That is why my eyes become proptosed!

hiyoshi said...

Errr....this sounds too weird for me to digest. I think I'll just leave the comments to the others T_T

Trust said...

Doktor kena check reference lah,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, sebab saya tak pasti sama ada cerai itu hukumnya haram atau tak.

Sebab cerai is something that *halal* tapi ALLAH tak suka.

There is a big fundamental difference between "tak suka" dengan "haram".

ALLAH lebih terer.

dr in the house said...

Thank you all for the rousing responses...I will try to respond back one to one when time permits. For now:

1) Remember few days ago Blogspot was having problem and we had difficulty to access our sites? That's when I found there were written 4 comments but only found 2 in the box. So I guess that's when Keng's and Trust's comments got gobbled up.

2) Trust, I know divorce is halal and only Allah knows best. But can a man divorce a wife without any valid reason but simply because he wants to take another who demands he divorced the first???

Has said...

Jangan lah marah dan geram sangat. Kita sebenar tak tahu apa masalah dan keperitan yang dialami oleh mereka. Ambilnya sebagai iktibar, dan kita tengok kepada diri kita dan pasangan kita. Kita buat yang terbaik.

Masalah besar yang kerap menjadi asas ketidakharmonian rumahtangga ialah perkara2 keintiman dan seksual. Tau2 aje le, seorang isteri mungkin nampak all out sayang kat suami, tapi dalam bilek tidur lain cerita. Kadang2 perempuan ni very possesive of their husband but basically the motives of possession are status, image, financial, security etc etc, kadang2 bukan sayang sangat kat the "person" yang di jodohkan sebagai suami.

Has said...

so tambah sikit, kalau ada perempuan yang boleh sayang lebih dari kita sayang suami kita, ni secara jujur lah, kalau kita sayang kat suami kita, then kita boleh let him go, buat apa berebut-rebut. Women should have enough self esteem and assets to be able to take this stand.

My own: "If you want to go for another woman, you are free to do so, but please think carefully cos I won't be waiting for your return and if you did return, I will not be here".

Cerita Zuleika tak habis dengan Nabi Yusuf, semasa Nabi Yusuf berkuasa dan terserempak Zuleika di jalanan di telah melamar Zuleika, tetapi masa itu Zuleika berkata bahawa cintanya kepad Yusuf menemukan dia dengan cinta yang sejati dan abadi. So ladies, be progressive and look at the bigger picture, itu pun kalau anda wanita sejati.

sorry bikin kacau lagi, keh, keh, keh.

Paul Moss again said...

Dith,

"But can a man divorce a wife without any valid reason but simply because he wants to take another who demands he divorced the first??? "
1. Yes he can. But is it antara perkara perkara terpuji or is it perkara berdosa? That`s the question.
2. What is a valid reason? How many reasons have we heard from the man that we can conclude he have none at all?

Paul Moss lagi said...

Answer to question no 1.
It`s (e) None of the above.

Sayuti said...

yes, he can. he just simply can. hukumnya halal. kalau halal tak berdosa.

cuma, kalau ada unsur penganiayaan di situ, maka dosa penganiayaan lah. tapi, kalau tak ceraikan, menyeksa batin, berdosa jugak.

nak tahu lebih lanjut, pegi kursus kawen.

Jiwa Rasa said...

drroza,
sometimes its not that easy being a healtcare provider. You have to bear the problems which are normally beyond the job scope of a medical provider.

There are studies about complaints and feedback in hospitals where 70% of the complaints are non clinical.

What to do!

Just lend your ears and pretend to be emphatic.. :)

Robin said...

It is tough.. being a doctor and a marriage counsellor.

But because of the relationship between the patient and his doctor, they sometimes feel that by just talking to doctor, it is already healing.

perhaps, the role of the doctor is more than patient counselling.

easylady said...

Ni kena tanya org yg arif pasal hal agama..tapi IMHO

Kalau isteri menduakan suami,tidak mengamalkan perintah tuhan.. validlahtu.Isteri yang setia pada suami tak patutlah diceraikan hanya kerana yg muda suruh ceraikan. Kekalkan dia sebagai isteri..tanggunglah kehidupan keluarga pertama kerana reasonnya isteri pertama cannot match his sexual desire.

Zalim namanya pada isteri dan anak-anak terutama jika isteri tidak berkerja.

Kalau bekerja lainlah cerita boleh tanggung diri sendiri dan anak-anak sepeti has kata..bye..bye..lah

Ikelah said...

assaamualaikum,

of course its halal to divorce a wife without any reason. its allowed in Islam. u can marry 4 in the morning, divorced all 4 the next day n remarry. 3 questions to ask?

1. is it normal if a person does that?
2. does 'zalim' takes place in the process?
3. does it contradicts with the spirit/ethics in family building as practice by the prophet.

i think what dith wants to bring up is not the halal haram issue. he is allowed to divorce her and the process of divorcing it no sin.
what she wanted us to see is the attitude of this guy and the effect to the family. a muslim following the teachings of the prophet will adhere not only to the syariah but also conduct a proper muslim akhlak/tasawuff. it concerns kalb, ur heart. ur very halal action might hurt someone even though by just a simple action or word.

for this guy, "think with ur brain based on proper knowledge scanned by a good heart"

wallahu 'alam

Trust said...

"zalim" tak equal "haram". Ingat tu.

"pretend to be emphatic"???? Marah Ismail Merican woi doktor takde bedside skills....

Saya pun marah sebab saya pernah kena dengan doktor kat A&E.... Belum interview saya, dia tanya MA, "apa pasat itu patient?" MA jawab, "migraine" Doktor ni jawab, "Kasi ponstan lo"

Itu bedside skills???? Yang memalukan sangat, bukannya doktor ni graduate dari medical school atas rumah kedai, tapi dari THE GREAT UKM MEDICAL SCHOOL.

Kalau Ged baca komen ni sah teruk aku kena belasah ni.

Paul Moss kuat taki said...

Answer to the questions :
1. Not normal to marry 4 and divorce all 4 the next morning.
2. The attitude of this guy cannot be judged as zalim due to insufficient information.
3. Family spirit/ethics as practised by the prophet is on a wider platform than we are used too where although poligamy is agreed as halal by all muslims yet not at all welcomed and word family is often refered for the first wife (side) and the other wives are still outsiders/intruders. For valid reasons? Reasons are only required when there`s no keredhaan. Yes...it`s actually a matter of the heart.

Has said...

he he he, aku gelak habis baca, sebabnya, ada paul moss lah, ada ismail merican lah, eikk betul ke eja ismail merican tu, he he sorry ler, aku dengar dia tak suka orang salah sebut or eja nama dia.

ikelah, may be husband dia dah baru biru dengan the first wife, nak tasawwuf cam na? maybe tension kat kepala bawah dah naik kepala atas juga.

tak yah kisah hal orang ler, kita jaga isteri/laki kita elok-elok baik. bila patients mengadu, kita be sincerely emphatic, sebab tu pong dah very healing dah.

dr in the house said...

Has- do they still do ECTs nowadays?

QOTH- the nearest mediaction would be antidepressants la..apa lagi?

Pycno- Boogey's love-story requires a whole entry...when he decided to marry ******, we had arranged an engagement ceremony which he only knew of the night before when I was busy making the sireh junjung!!

Paul, Sayuti, Trust, Ikelah- so conclusion nya: it's harus for a man to divorce his wife without any logical sound reason but it's looked down upon and not a sunnah. Correct?

Easylady- nampak gaya kena pergi kursus kawin semula la yek? hehe...zaman kawe dulu tak payah pergi kursus kawin ...kawe belajar dgn ustazah sendiri...

Robin- You-re a medical lawyer. What is your speciality?

Jiwarasa- that's the whole problem. Pyschological ailments require time-consuming management which we GPs cant afford to give especialy during peak hours. We need special people in special clinics handling such cases

Paul Moss said...

DITH,
That`s the problem I`m frequently having with Roslan and Gee. Their perception of logical sound is completely different from mine. Also I can`t judge based solely on sound, I need to see also. Maybe what I see is more logical than the sound. Then maybe it won`t be looked down only but both up and down.

Trust said...

In fact, Doctor, kalau nak ikut Sunnah, if the husband *feels* like he no longer can fulfil the conjugal duties sebab dia *dah tak selera* dengan wife dia, he *can* divorce his wife.

That Sunnah comes from our Prophet SAW himself. Sayidatina Saudah, isteri Rasulullah yang paling tua umurnya, Rasulullah nak ceraikan dia because of that fact. Tapi Sayidatina Saudah was willing to bagi her giliran to the other wives of the Prophet, just as long as she could remain his wife.

Betulkan saya kalau cerita saya ni tak betul.

Sayuti said...

dith: harus atau tidak saya tak tahu. tapi, sah talaknya.

abstrak dari kursus kawen yang saya pegi 3 tahun lepas:
kuasa utk nikah dipegang pihak perempuan. kuasa utk mencerai terletak pada pihak laki. so, pada pihak perempuan, buatlah pilihan betul2. lelaki takpe. kalau silap pilih boleh cerai bila2, ikut suka hati, dan takde waiting period utk kawen dengan yang lain. maka yang perempuan, gunalah kuasa yang ada pada anda betul2 seblom terlewat.

p/s: komen dari jiwarasa dan nick dith mengingatkan saya pada sitcom dr house. lama dah tak tengok.

Ikelah said...

i dont think its fair to accused the prophet offering our mother saudah a divorce because of *dah tak selera* dengan wife dia, with the possibility unable to fulfill the conjugal duties. With this incidence one take it as Sunnah.

Our great prophet married saudah after her husband died just after they got back fron hijrah to habsyah. she was alone with her aged father, poor and nobody to look after her. At the time of marriage she was a middle age lady about 65 yrs, plump with nothing special except for a devoted muslim. Is it relevant to talk about 'selera' at age of 65?

He had many wives was not to 'satisfy his sexual lust' as some people claimed (he had 11 wives excluding maria alqibtiyah). All except Aisyah were not of their first marriage.
he married them for various reasons stated in alQuran and al Hadiths; husbands died while defending their faith, improve relationship with devotees and tribal leaders etc.

he did offer her a divorce as written by Islamic schoolars and historians with the reason of that the prophet was worried that Sawda might be upset about having to compete with so many younger wives. Younger means younger than sawdah. Our mother salama whom our prophet married later than sawda was also 65 at time of marriage.

if we are talking about selera and conjugal duties, our prophet would search for younger women, accept the beauties offered by the Quraish and other tribal leaders but he did not.

I believed that we should use a proper and better word when talking about our beloved prophet.

Lastly, there are many non muslim schoolars(some even using Islamic names) taking advantage in writing confusing remarks regarding our prophet's marriage. I could still remember one of our ex minister, getting his pHD in usuluddin from a jew professor as his mentor.

wallahu 'alam.

Trust said...

"I believed that we should use a proper and better word when talking about our beloved prophet."

Moga ALLAH dan Rasul-Nya ampun dan maafkan saya.

But my point is this: Lust is so accomodated in Islam (dulunya) such that sekarang ni kita rasa pelik orang kahwin ramai. The Prophet may have eleven wives at the time of turunnya Ayat yang menetapkan lelaki tak boleh kahwin more than empat but before this ayat turun, he has more than eleven wives! Not just that, he also had concubines, spoils of war yang kalau baginda suka, dapat continue jadi wife dia, kalau baginda tak suka, terus jadi hamba baginda. Contohnya ialah ibu kepada Sayidina Ibrahim, yang mati kecil (correct me if I am wrong).

My point is this, (again), we must talk all these openly and subjectively and WITHIN CONTEXT. I am not out untuk mengelirukan sesama Islam or nak menghina Rasulullah SAW. Hundreds, if not a thousand years ago, the hukum-hakam of Islam allows a man to fulfil his lust in as many ways he could. Sekarang ni, meletup dunia kalau suami cakap nak kahwin lagi satu. Nak kenal adil lah, nak kena banyak duit lah, nak kena isteri mandullah, nak kena suami terbukti kuat tenaga seks lah.

Ask around and we'll be surprised ramai tak tahu Rasulullah SAW ada 11 isteri! Ramai tak tahu before that Baginda ada ramai hamba!

The Muslims understanding nowadays of marriage and love and sex are very much looked upon from the Judeo-Christian Western eyeglasses.

Mawi said...

Ni cerita pasal apa ni?

kenakelayan said...

Trust

:) But how sure are you that those marriages were for lust? How sure are you that Islamic law allows a man to fulfil his desire in many ways?

Now what I am sure of is Islam is the Middle Path, the Way of Moderation. And what I am certain of is that no one can be a better exemplar of this than our Beloved Rasulullah, peace be upon him. A man who spends most of his nights in prayer till his feet are swollen, and his day administering the Islamic Nation doesn't sound like an unbalanced man to me.

Now I would say that yes, Islam does recognise desires as a natural part of man, but what it does is regulate it so that desires are fulfilled in a responsible manner, within marriage. And may I remind you that it is just as equally incumbent upon the husband to keep his wife chaste by satisfying her desires? ;)

One has to take a more holistic view of things, I feel, in order to avoid tunnel-vision, ie, men, it is NOT all about you! :)

And Allah knows best.

Trust said...

Agreed. Not all about men. But most are about men.

Sorryyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy.

Now don't be bringing that men are mentioned equally in numbers with women in Quran. Circumstantial evidence are just circumstantial.

Paul Moss said...

I want to make some correction.
1. It`s all about the whole creation, the whole thing.
2. It`s THE path.

50 comments so far. Quite a record eh?

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